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 Post subject: Bamboo ID please
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:46 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2016 11:32 pm
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Location: S. Louisiana, 9a
I think this is Bambusa Multiplex Riviereorum "Chinese Goddess." Dug up and divided a neighbors mature clump which was roughly 3' diameter and 6-7' tall.

[imgImage][/img]


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 Post subject: Re: Bamboo ID please
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:49 pm 
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Location: S. Louisiana, 9a
[img][IMG]http://i1317.photobucket.com/albums/t636/jcomeaux2/DSC_0007_zpsh8j9chm2.jpg[/img][/img]


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 Post subject: Re: Bamboo ID please
PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2017 9:36 pm 
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Location: S. Louisiana, 9a
Not enough pics/info? Or is it just too hard to ID something with so many varieties without seeing it in person? Let me know....I'm still a bamboo noob.


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 Post subject: Re: Bamboo ID please
PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2017 10:48 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2005 9:14 pm
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Location: Carmichael, CA
Bamboo Society Membership: ABS - America
I think it is a combination of not enough to go on and perhaps not many people here familiar with the species. More leaves would help, shoots as well.

I think you are on the right track, it looks like a B multiplex but which form? The small leaves do suggest Riverorium but to my eyes the multiplex forms looks alike save for A Karr and Silverstripe.

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Brad Salmon, zone 9 Esparto, CA


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 Post subject: Re: Bamboo ID please
PostPosted: Sat Apr 08, 2017 9:17 am 
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Location: SE TX, Zone 9a
I do not have much experience with the smaller Bambusa multiplex varieties, as I prefer the more arborescent types, so I do not have high confidence in any help that I can provide. However, I think you are on the right track.

See: http://www.bamboo.org/BambooSourceList/BambooPlants.php?G=60&Dv=+&Hv=+&Tc=%3C%3D&Tv=+&Sv=+&C=&M=1&Button=FIND&U=I&S=1

As the ABS Bamboo Species List says, 'Riviereorum' is similar to 'Fernleaf'. The ABS says that 'Riviereorum' has solid culms, so you may check for this trait. I do not know whether 'Fernleaf' has solid culms.

They say of 'Fernleaf': "Often culms come up that have reverted to the larger leaves." I have heard from other sources that 'Fernelaf' is indeed less stable. I also believe that I have seen plants in public gardens labeled as 'Fernleaf' that were producing occasional larger culms with more normal leaves. If the original established clump did not have any culms that were reverting to the larger type, that may point to it being 'Riviereorum'. Having said that, it is possible that the plants I have seen were mislabeled, and I suspect that these plants are often confused.

More photographs of healthy foliage might help.

Also, when requesting identifications, it is helpful to us if you provide your general geographic location in your profile. Based on your username, I think you are in Louisiana.


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 Post subject: Re: Bamboo ID please
PostPosted: Sat Apr 08, 2017 12:00 pm 
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Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2016 11:32 pm
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Location: S. Louisiana, 9a
Thanks for the replies! I'm in S. Louisiana, zone 9a...just tried to update my user location and got an error, but will try again.

The culms are solid, and every leaf is tiny. No new culms since dividing and replanting, but I'll keep an eye out. The plant was in rough shape and I divided it very aggressively, so I'm just happy that all of the divisions survived. I'll take a few more pics today.


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 Post subject: Re: Bamboo ID please
PostPosted: Sat Apr 08, 2017 1:32 pm 
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Location: S. Louisiana, 9a
I've been searching and can't find any other solid culm small multiplex with tiny leaves. Does anyone know of one?


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 Post subject: Re: Bamboo ID please
PostPosted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 9:04 pm 
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Location: S. Louisiana, 9a
So almost every Chinese Goddess for sale online has larger leaves than my bamboo. The sellers who have contacted me back with those larger leaf plants all confirm they aren't solid culms. The plant that I divided looked exactly like this bamboo's neglected twin: https://www.plantdelights.com/products/ ... stale-link I'm certain this is the same bamboo that I have.

Chris with Plant Delights Nursery was nice enough to check the culms...sure enough, they are solid. Any objections to me calling this a +ID?


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 Post subject: Re: Bamboo ID please
PostPosted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 11:07 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2005 9:14 pm
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Location: Carmichael, CA
Bamboo Society Membership: ABS - America
Roll with it!

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Brad Salmon, zone 9 Esparto, CA


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 Post subject: Re: Bamboo ID please
PostPosted: Tue Apr 11, 2017 7:35 am 
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Location: SE TX, Zone 9a
Welcome to the confusing world of bamboo identification. Assigning a name to a bamboo plant often involves wading into the murky waters where taxonomy and horticulture meet.

I once received a bamboo from a reputable nursery, and when it proved to be something other than what I ordered, the nursery was unable to identify what they had sent me, or understand how the mixup could have occurred. For years in Texas, almost every Bambusa textilis plant sold was actually Bambusa tuldoides. Even after the problem was well known, some nurseries continued the practice. One nursery that sold me a misidentified plant acknowledged the problem, but said it was no big deal, as the two species are fairly equivalent. They are not, especially where cold winters are concerned. At a bamboo sale at a botanic garden in Texas, I once saw a plant for sale by a vendor that was labeled Bambusa tuldoides 'Textilis'. I hope nobody is now perpetuating that name.

When someone receives a plant under one name, especially from a "reliable" source, they usually are biased to believe that is the correct name, so they perpetuate the name, even if it is incorrect. In Texas, I have seen several Bambusa multiplex forms for sale that carry names that are not found elsewhere. Are these new forms, new names for old forms, or a mixture of both? I do not know the answer. I do believe that this species commonly sports, producing new horticultural forms that can not be easily described by taxonomy.

I think in your case, the preponderance of evidence is pointing toward 'Riviereorum'. Compare your plant with this description:
http://www.efloras.org/florataxon.aspx?flora_id=2&taxon_id=200024949

Finally, note the statement on this page:
http://www.efloras.org/florataxon.aspx?flora_id=2&taxon_id=200024943
"Most taxa are beautiful ornamental bamboos, but their identification, classification, and nomenclature remain complex and controversial. Many varieties, forms, and cultivars have been published, given new status, and variously combined under the species recognized by different authorities. "

My opinion: Call it 'Riviereorum', but when you come across similar plants with labels, take a look to see what characteristics they possess.

I appreciate your serious interest in correctly identifying your plant, and I wish I had enough knowledge to provide more help in this case.


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 Post subject: Re: Bamboo ID please
PostPosted: Tue Apr 11, 2017 12:51 pm 
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Location: S. Louisiana, 9a
Great info and links Glen. My plants seem to match the description that you linked perfectly: "Culms 1–3 m, 3–5 mm in diam.; internodes solid. Branches usually bent downward, bow-shaped. Culm sheath slanted along one side, apex asymmetrically arched-convex. Ultimate branches with 13–23 leaves; blades small, 1.6–3.2 × 0.3–0.7 cm." It's the only multiplex I could find with this small of a leaf. Almost all other Chinese Goddess' for sale online seem to have leaves at least twice this length and larger hollow culms...so certainly mislabeled.

Could you please explain "apex asymmetrically arched-convex" in layman's terms?


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 Post subject: Re: Bamboo ID please
PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 2:19 am 
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Location: SE TX, Zone 9a
The apex is the top of the culm sheath, where it joins the culm sheath blade. Convex means it arches up. Asymmetric means that the peak is not in the center of the arch. Stated another way, the sheath is not bilaterally symmetrical when folded lengthwise.

Perhaps some visual examples can better explain what the authors of this flora mean by their words. Different botanical authors often use slightly different definitions, so it is always useful to take a broad look at a flora in order to figure out exactly what a particular author means.

"Slightly Assymetrical"
http://www.efloras.org/florataxon.aspx?flora_id=2&taxon_id=200024916
Illustration 12: http://www.efloras.org/object_page.aspx?object_id=95040&flora_id=2

"Asymmetrically Arched"
http://www.efloras.org/florataxon.aspx?flora_id=2&taxon_id=242307685
Illustration 1: http://www.efloras.org/object_page.aspx?object_id=95040&flora_id=2

"Asymmetrically Arched" - They describe most botanical varieties of Bambusa multiplex this way, including the one you probably have.
http://www.efloras.org/florataxon.aspx? ... =200024943
Illustration 1: http://www.efloras.org/object_page.aspx?object_id=95050&flora_id=2

"Subtruncate" - Truncate means that it looks like is was cut off "square", so subtruncate means that it is not quite "square". See: http://www.cactus-art.biz/note-book/Dictionary/Dictionary_T/dictionary_truncate.htm
http://www.efloras.org/florataxon.aspx?flora_id=2&taxon_id=242307739
Illustration 13: http://www.efloras.org/object_page.aspx?object_id=95725&flora_id=2

"Extremely Asymmetrical"
http://www.efloras.org/florataxon.aspx?flora_id=2&taxon_id=200024927
Illustration 1: http://www.efloras.org/object_page.aspx?object_id=95725&flora_id=2

This may also help:
Illustration: http://www.eeob.iastate.edu/research/bamboo/characters/character-images/cl-4.jpg
Here is the accompanying description (See CL-4): http://www.eeob.iastate.edu/research/bamboo/characters/culm-leaf.html

Culm sheath characteristics are critical for the identification of bamboos, but remember that some of these characteristics will not be typical until the plant is producing fairly mature shoots.


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 Post subject: Re: Bamboo ID please
PostPosted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 4:47 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2016 11:32 pm
Posts: 34
Location: S. Louisiana, 9a
Thank you for taking the time to educate me on all of this. I had no idea how useful culm sheaths could be in proper ID of bamboo. I feel like I just earned 1 credit hour in Bootany and owe you tuition!


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 Post subject: Re: Bamboo ID please
PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2017 8:40 am 
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Location: SE TX, Zone 9a
I am glad that I could be of assistance.


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