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PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:49 pm 
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Well, that looks pretty clear to me.

The question is, why would you chose to do this instead of getting rhizome with the division in the first place?

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2011 9:13 pm 
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Some phyllostachys have a very hard time in producing long enough rhizomes to take good divisions without disturbing the rest of the clump so it is not always feasible to take a field division, but this only applies to those growing bamboo in the far north like me.

Even for the ones that do run such as my parvifolia, if there are smaller shoots that come up in the middle of the grove which will never see enough sun to thrive, sticking a nursery pot over them, and turning them into a division will put it to good use, and as you can see by these pictures, the root & rhizome growth still comes on strong despite having no rhizome attachment at all. I let the shoot grow out for 2 months before extracting it, and surprisingly there was no leaf curl at all, maybe because I topped it while it was still rising, reducing the foliage.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:59 pm 
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Location: plus 700ft in the Santa Cruz Mtns, 8 miles from the Pacific 35 miles S. of San Jose
Steve - ref heteroclada I got from you a couple of years ago: decided to depot it to see if I cld jump start it. The soil that surrounded the roots (original soil that you sent it in) looked like pure adobe clay (very heavy & very hard). I had a hard time getting it off the original roots using high water pressure. There were a few new feeder roots in the soil that I had added last year but root development was nihl in the original soil. It's clear that new root development was impeded by the soil. Assuming that is your natural soil, your rhizome running/production is going to be limited if you don't add lots of steer or horse fertilizer to loosen your soil and add 6 to 8 inches of mulch. rgds


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 31, 2011 8:32 pm 
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That clay soil was well before I started building my compost pile and adding tons of manure to my bamboo groves, and when I was a complete Newbie to growing bamboos. I definitely didn't know how to ship them effectively, but since that trade, I have shipped hundreds of bamboos mainly by flat rate boxes, and very efficiently since most of what I sell is over the internet. I figured that it's not that hard to produce my own potting soil with peat moss as a base, but that's a good point about adding even more organic material to get my bamboos to start running.

BTW, I bet your moso is probably bigger than mine now. I know heterocladas tend up upsize very slowly since I have kept 2 of them just to watch their progress.

Just to give an idea, here are some of my least aggressive bamboos. If I didn't try watering them and adding organic materials, they probably woudn't even run this far. This is why I've always been trying to come up with alternative propagation methods. I'm sure anyone north of me or in the UK may face the same problems.
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 31, 2011 11:59 pm 
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Again, if you've been growing bamboo for only 2 full seasons or perhaps 3 AND you've shipped hundreds of divisions as you suggest your slow rhizome spread may be directly linked to making hundreds of divisions. Or maybe you mean divisions of seedlings you've sprouted? I seem to recall you saying that an F rufa you gave a neighbor was bigger than your own, perhaps due to dividing too soon/too much?

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:13 am 
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The moso met a worse fate - looks like the soil did it in. Good if you have moved to major mulch/fertilizer. Your input that you have sent hundreds of small plants is a bit uncomforting to me. You need a fair amount of experience to make small into big. In addition, survival re plants that have been taken from mother plants less than 2 or 3 years old is quite low. Rgds


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:31 am 
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I'm including seedlings & all forms of propagation. I got around 40 off of parvifolia which is my top performer, maybe 25 off bissetii, around 30 off rubro, and dug out my entire moso grove which had about 40-45 division.

I usually always wait until they show signs of life such as making new culms for rhizomes before sending plants. Here's what I mean. I mailed this one after those 2 new shoots leafed out. If I waited too long, they would no longer fit in flat rate boxes which seems to be the most cost efficient way in sending out mass quantities of small plants.
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Again, if you've been growing bamboo for only 2 full seasons or perhaps 3 AND you've shipped hundreds of divisions as you suggest your slow rhizome spread may be directly linked to making hundreds of divisions. Or maybe you mean divisions of seedlings you've sprouted? I seem to recall you saying that an F rufa you gave a neighbor was bigger than your own, perhaps due to dividing too soon/too much?


For the extra slow performers, I've hardly taken any divisions. For example, only 2 off of Dulcis, 4 from atro, 2 off propinqua, and 1 off of YG which are all pretty established clumps over 10ft tall, so I doubt that would halt them from running when parvifolia has already turned into a nice grove with many more divisions removed. Maybe I can't take any divisions at all off the slow bamboos if I want them to take up some space. As far as the rufa, mine has only been getting wider without divisions taken off of it, sticking around 2ft while my neighbor's which was a 5 culm division has gotten up towards 3ft and is shooting again, but mine's under almost full shade which may be stunting it's growth.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 01, 2011 3:51 pm 
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Location: plus 700ft in the Santa Cruz Mtns, 8 miles from the Pacific 35 miles S. of San Jose
I might be behind the power curve on my info but the advice that I got at two seminars on growing bamboo at UCSC (University of California Santa Cruz) was not to prune, divide, etc bamboo plants until their 3 year and then take out 1/3 of mature culms (only). This was 10 plus years ago so there may be better advice/data available. Rgds


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 01, 2011 4:38 pm 
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I never wanted to divide off of the slow runners, but whenever someone requests a division off of a species, I don't refuse, as long as I still have many culms in my clump.

As far as getting plants to people locally, I have stuck to 5 gallon sized divisions and bigger since they are much easier to establish, and reach good sizes fast. I guess not every species can be like parvifolia where I can seemingly take divisions all the time, and it still spreads more than everything else along with upsize faster than most.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 01, 2011 10:03 pm 
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Steve, what we are suggesting to you is that perhaps even your best growers would be even larger/run farther if left alone for 3-4 years and that although you can get immature, small divisions to live what kind of vigor are you sending to the recipient? Ease & efficiency of shipping seems an odd criteria for making divisions. Small plants the size that you ship may need 2-3 years before they gain enough mass/vigor to be planted out and many people do not have proper overwintering capacity for bamboo plants so IF it is possible that you are depriving your own groves and shipping possibly sluggish plants then where is the benefit to anyone?

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 02, 2011 12:19 am 
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If that is true, my parvifolia would be a monster by now if I never took any divisions, but 12ft in 2 years is not bad from a plant that was under 1ft tall in 2009. It may be 15ft by 10ft wide if I never divided from it but it already looks good to me at 12ft by 6ft wide so I'm not too concerned.

Also the only reason that I take small divisions for shipping is that most people are not willing to even pay for the shipping of a huge division that is super well developed, and flat rate boxes only accomodate up to a certain size. I've tried, before, but most people tend to prefer the smaller stuff that I can sell for cheaper, and if they are in the same zone as me or colder, I will let them know it is hard to grow there, and give possible ways to over-winter. I think someone in Zone 3-4 Wisconson still bought a moso seedling from me regardless of the warning. I also don't put them up on ebay until they start generating shoots or rhizomes.

Lets say I was to ship one of these guys. A 15 gallon boo 8-10ft high, with rhizome belts starting and roots filling up the pot. I wouldn't be able to remove much soil and might even have to top it to get it to fit in a shippable box. Since I can't get rid of any soil, It would weigh 50lbs or more and if they are in for example California where I lots of buyers, just shipping the boos would be crazy expensive.
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Now lets use a typical bamboo I do ship. Here's a 2 gallon division taken 1 month ago which should be ready in perhaps 4-8 weeks which is enough time for it to make some rhizomes and finish growing its shoots. It should be definitely be good enough to over-winter in it's proper climate. This can easily be shipped in a medium flat rate box which only costs 10.95, and it generally takes only 2 days to ship with priority flat rate boxes as opposed to ground mail. Something like this will generally cost the buyer 20-30$ and most buyers generally don't want to pay much more if they are just starting out with bamboo.
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Most ebay buyers will go with the smaller option. Also a 3 month old division with rhizomes and well established is already far better than the rhizomes that ebayers sell all year round.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 02, 2011 1:18 pm 
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O.K., never mind, what do I know anyway. The legend of Ebay vendors continues...Caveat Emptor.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 03, 2011 12:52 am 
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Any young culm that is buried more/again, will tend to send out rhizomes from from the lower, buried nodes. I think that is pretty standard behavior - mine always have done so.

I have found the answer to your question why your dulcis has not expanded much. Although some varieties will do better in some locales than others, they will all be relatively stunted by having dirt put over new culms and then cut.

To get as good a stand of bamboo as possible per variety and local conditions, leaving it alone for a minimum of three years is the way to go - more if you want more.

However, if you want to do business, it is possible to continually divide and sell, leaving just enough of the original to stay alive.

It's all a matter of priority.

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To locals: If there is something in the Trade column of my plant list you want a start for, I root-prune every so often to control the bamboo in my limited space. You are welcome to any starts for free, no trading. Let me know and come get it if it's available. Pick up only.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 03, 2011 1:00 am 
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Steve i think what everyone is to polite to say but im not is, that you don't have a clue what your doing , your ripping people off with sub-par boo that most likely dies,and your in it to make a quick buck.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 03, 2011 1:23 am 
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Steve i think what everyone is to polite to say but im not is, that you don't have a clue what your doing , your ripping people off with sub-par boo that most likely dies,and your in it to make a quick buck.


Then you must have never seen my testimonials or 100% positive feedback on ebay, or how my prices compare to all of the other vendors, but you can think whatever you want. I've grown bamboo long enough to know that once bamboos produce rhizomes and new shoots and a solid root mass produced while they were in the pot, they are no longer sub-par, and will thrive with the proper care.

I'm one of the only ones that will post a picture of exactly what I am selling, and have a 100% refund or replacement policy and I am very proud of what I do. If you still doubt me, I can get you the emails or phone numbers of as many customers want since I keep those on my email and you can ask them about the plants I have sold.

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