Hey guys, I don't post much but I did post up my P. Spectabilis last year when I first received it. It did really well but had some top kill during this winter, I gave it some protection via plastic sheeting but it wasn't fully covered.

I'll post pics from before (from other thread) and then now...

My very first planter box! I know it doesn't look the greatest but it was my very first project.


Received this 5 gallon Spectabilis from Bamboo World Canada:


In my planter box! May 20, 2010


7 days later, May 27, 2010



Latest pics:

May 26, 2011:

As you can see, it got a little smaller because I had to trim off the dead portions of it..

June 7, 2011:

Huge upsizing! I'm really impressed and satisfied for its' first year!

I sent you a PM about this, but I'll repeat it here for others.

Don't expect the raised bed to contain the rhizomes -- you'll still need to rhizome prune around the outside of the box.

I'm growing a couple of Phyllostachys in raised beds like this and the rhizomes escape every year even though the one box is 3' tall on the one side. In fact the box makes rhizome pruning more difficult because: 1) rhizomes go deeper before turning upward again 2) the box gets in the way when you're trying to jump on the spade to cut rhizomes.

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Alan.
My blog: It's not work, it's gardening!

Wow seriously? But I heard that most bamboo only grow 8 - 12" beneath the surface and I've heard that a lot of the time. When do you think I should start rhizome pruning and how should I go about doing it?

Thanks Alan!

You thought the same way I did, but a raised bed is not the same as the ground. If you look at the conditions below the ground that the plant is "using" to determine how deep to go, I presume it's oxygen availability, temperatures, water. Now look at the side of a raised bed -- is it any different than the surface of the soil? Not really, so rhizomes grow happily. Plus they're getting deflected away from horizontal, which could be down or could be up.

I wonder how deep of a box they'd grow out of? I think 4' at least -- there's a nursery near me that has a ratty Yellow Groove planting in a raised bed made from landscape blocks. It's about 4' tall, and there were rhizomes visible outside the planter.

(All of this applies to raised beds, not barriers sunk below the surface of the ground.)

Here's one raised bed I removed last year:



Here's the link to the last post including timelapse video of the process:
http://www.itsnotworkitsgardening.com/2 ... video.html

Rhizome pruning: I don't think you'll need to worry about it until late fall or late winter. Needmore likes to prune in February I think.

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Alan.
My blog: It's not work, it's gardening!

Alan is most correct , I'm going to install rhizome barrier and then the raised bed when I expand the beds here. I have runners all over the place. Good news for propagatong parvifolia as there are four shoots in the lawn. Bad news on parvifolia propagation two of those shoots are more than an inch and a half across.

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Always experimenting to get Timber Bamboos Timber size

Squishee, Alan is quite correct about above ground planters and having to check the surrounding grounds for escaped rhizomes. However you have one advantage that Alan does not. Phyllostachys spread the most in warm and humid climates. To use my home as an example, the running bamboos go active in March and stop running in October. Thats 8 months of potential rhizome growth that must be deflected or pruned each year. Your growing season should be short enough that combined with top kill i wouldn't think it to be a huge problem. Do a perimeter check with a spade once a year around the month of August and that should be enough. I'd worry more about top kill then anything else.

M

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M

I'm about the same climate as Squishee, and rhizomes do grow, but usually always well less than the height of the culms, and since they don't grow that deep when they are planted straight in the soil, rhizomes are very easy to detect.

As far as top-kill, I don't think spectabilis is very vulnerable in z6 based on what I've read. One thing that does become a problem in my climate is that heavy wet snow or ice will break branches and culms. My p atrovaginata had 2 of it's culms completely snapped under the ice last winter because it probably has weaker culms than most other bamboos. It also generates lots of foliage which doesn't help either since they catch the most snow, and this year, I'm getting 1 inchers that may be even more prone to breakage than the skinny culms from last year. I'm not sure how I'll be able to prevent this year's culms from snapping.



Those guys can easily be dwarfed for shipping purposes, or if you prefer, whips work too. I haven't tried rhizome propagating parvifolia yet, but I think it probably works, at least right before shooting season.

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http://www.flickr.com/photos/31489820@N02/

http://stevespeonygarden.blogspot.com/

I like your raised bed. I'm opting this myself, for some tomatoes...
Our native soil here in CentralFL's so sandy. Water and nutrients just drain through it...
That plant looks good coming from the nursery... Healthy.

Time for another planter, and another boo... Two's better than one

~BMC.

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Brandon, FL

27.95°N 82.28°W (Elev. 62 ft)

Zone 9A

Steve your giving me advise on growing and propagating I think you have told me four times in posts and pm's that I need more space in my four by four bed to grow big culms for next year. What is this based on , experience , no , just plain old hubris .If you look back in old posts I'll have been one of the guys teaching you about Whipshoots, Whipshoots aaargh . What I know is you give bad advise 50 percent of the time and you never listen to anyone . What I know is I've been growing Bamboo for 9 years , so still a beginner , after I've been growing for another nine years I may have a handle on growing Phy. You have been growing Bamboo for two or three years , but from the first year I remember all the how to grow Bamboo Laws you came up with . There are no Bamboo Laws and the more one knows about Bamboo the more exceptions to any hint of a rule are found . I don't answer every post out there because if I don't know the answer then a post is useless to the person asking a question. Please never presume to advise me again .
Whipshoots , I know where I'd like to plant one.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hubris

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Always experimenting to get Timber Bamboos Timber size

I don't spend much time on my posts so maybe i did say it 4 times, and don't remember. I don't even remember where I learned about whip shoots, but yea, I guess you were probably the one that taught me about them.

As far as what I give as advice, I base it on what I've observed, and I do read other people's posts, but I pick and choose what I want to believe.

Also, I didn't come up with any laws. I only come up with observations on what I believe about bamboo which I do admit has changed over time when I see old posts, but I also think you are coming across as a bit negative, but I can see your pov if I insulted your knowledge without meaning to do so.

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http://www.flickr.com/photos/31489820@N02/

http://stevespeonygarden.blogspot.com/

Is there a technique for dwarfing 1.5 inch culm shoots other than chopping off tops and branches? The only alternative that I can think of is to disturb the root system to yield shortened internodes and a dwarfed height, but then the resulting culm has a weakened root system to live with for the season.

On a parvifolia of that maturity, whip shoots may be quite uncommon.

Oh, propagating with parvifolia rhizomes extracted before shooting season definitely works.
Pot them up and keep them buried or indoors protected from freezing until the last frost, then move them outside to a place where they won't dry out.

Now regarding 1.5 inch shoots coming up from the lawn, my preferred action would be to catch the shoots early and eat 'em.

Steve , I know your passionate about Bamboo and that's a great thing, what I'm asking (badly I'll admit) is for you to just chill and think an answer through . If you don't know something at least 90 percent then leave it to someone else or expand on what you do know about your own experiments. Growing a parvifolia in a 4 by 4 box is my experiment . Based on what I have observed in multiple gardens I can get 4 inch culms in that area . Jos has grown huge Bamboo in small areas for 15 years and more . Not 4 by 4 but some of his groves large culms cover less that a 4 by 4 area , the rhizome run is double or triple that area but no more.
An unwritten rider should be for all answers , me included is ( this works in my garden , in my climate , but maybe different in your garden and conditions) .

As to topping or balancing a Bamboo division . If a culm division has one healthy branch and two dormant rhizome buds plus enough root to keep the blades from curling it should be viable. The more overall mass the better , more branches , more buds and more roots .When taking a divison the balance between root and branch is the most important. A division will show wilt within hours of cutting if the balance is way off. This can be corrected by cutting back the culm and branches. Getting the right roots is important , the small hair roots seem to do most of the work in keeping a Bamboo hydrated, the fleshy what I think of as anchor roots are not so good. The best divisons have the maximum amount of root , and this can be very hard to get. Large culm divisions tend to be slower to produce new culms, sometimes it takes a couple of years. Guys like Brad take two or three feet of rhizome for a large division and this helps them take faster. Any division should be potted up and put in full shade and then watched for the next few hours. If in a 24 hour period on a normal temp day the division does not wilt them it should be good to go. Many nursery guys will not sell a division until it's proved it's self by producing a new culm. So on a 1.5 inch Parvifolia I could cut it down to 3 feet of culm and a foot of rhizome and it should work , but it's not the best division. What I will try to do is keep the whole culm , if I use a hose to wash away soil from around the roots of the division ( and I mean a huge mudhole mess ) and take three feet of rhizome I may be able to keep the entire culm intact. A 15 gallon pot and a couple of weeks to settle in then I can pass it on to the person who wants it.

Clumpers I know little about, I grow them and generally don't mess with them . I'll be on a sharp learn curve soon as I have very small clumper here that needs to be sent out to a couple of the guys. Single culm division that is now producing two new culms. I need to make a few plants fast without killing any. Noah Bell has given me some advise which I will follow.
I'f I was in Europe I'd take the whole plant to Markj and get an on the spot master class

The best way to learn about Bamboo is to visit good growers and make them talk to you .

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Always experimenting to get Timber Bamboos Timber size

OK, I'll admit I do rush to answering questions sometimes based on stuff I've read from other posts, blogs etc. I haven't tried raised beds myself so perhaps I shouldn't be commenting on it without any personal experience. I'll try to avoid that, or maybe I just find pleasure in establishing as much forum presence as possible

As far as getting a balanced division, last week, I took 6 moso divisions from 7 week old culms, not fully leafed out yet, and all of them seem to have established by showing signs of new leaf growth which is surprising, but all of the divisions did happen to have the foliage/root mass balance, and all the other conditions. I expected them to croak, but they happened to make it so I'll have to try it some more, and do it with other species as well to see if it works on them. The culms also passed the finger-nail test so I guess they weren't that new, but I expected at least some of them to wilt.

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http://www.flickr.com/photos/31489820@N02/

http://stevespeonygarden.blogspot.com/

Squishee, great looking planter boxes! I look forward to seeing the progression of those plantings!

Steve in France, an experienced grower thinking he can get 4 inchers in a 4 by 4 box gives me hope for my own experiments. I have vivax, vivax Aureocaulis, and moso that I intend to try to get at least 4 inch culms from in 6-8 foot or so circles (planted in-ground, not raised). 2 of the "clumps" will of necessity be root pruned in a semi-circle because of the proximity to the house, but the rhizomes and roots will be free to roam in the yard on the other side of the circles. The intent is to eventually somewhat simulate the look of the large tropical clumpers that I cannot grow here. Look forward to seeing how your parv experiment plays out!

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God Bless,

Matthew

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Genesis 2:8 And the Lord God planted a garden eastward in Eden; and there He put the man whom He had formed.

Now Steve that is good info , I'm about to take culms earlier than I would like and have observed in the past that some Phy can be a bit lazy about putting roots around newer culms. I'll try and take divsions before total leafout . This may mean less stress from less blade surface and allow the plant to balance root and blade growth it's self.

On the SC front you should do well, I believe this climate in MD/DC is jsut about perfect for Phy growth, so SC should be very perfect too. I could never get the consistant size up results in France that I do here. I believe I get two or three years extra growth here in a season. If you want to really push your Bamboos then water everyday and use Miracle grow for fruit and veg once a week, plus Ironite two three times a years. When I was at Jos's a couple of months ago we talked about people who don't get a result from Bamboo, then say the clone is no good . Like Shanghai 3 , many people bought it and were disapointed with size up.
Jos is in Holland and Holland is not known for it's stunning climate but the results are there. Jos uses what is available , Pigeon manure from the guy nextdoor to him and Bamboo mulch. That's about it , well at least that is what he told me .

Here in MD it does not seem to make I difference if I feed early Spring , or I should say it does not mean a mass of small growth. I could be wrong but I figure that if you get tall dense growth in a limited space then the plant will push grow up past last years growth as there would be little gain for the plant to make the the same size or smaller growth that would be shaded out.
Jos had a nigra 'Boryana' I believe it was , anyway it had 4 or 5 culms at mature size and colour , it was a grove perhaps three feet across. How he does it I don't know , but I know it can be done. I remember the plant from 5 years ago, what it's like today I don't know.

Markj's theory on Phy in open ground is they stake out an area a few meters with rhizome then culms grow into it . The trouble for most gardeners is the area they stake out in the first couple of years tends to be about twenty feet across. In UK Northern France conditions the growth tends not to be consistant in terms of size for the first 8 years or so. Bamboos in confined spaces seem to go up in size faster if fed well.

Rambled on a bit there
Best Wishes
Steve

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Always experimenting to get Timber Bamboos Timber size